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shrike upper insert


boogie1967
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Hello all. I have been a member for a long time but my email was shut down and had to re register. I am looking for the insert that goes into the ares shrike upper that guides the round at a better angle. These were made by Mark Genovese several years back. Any leads on one would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks, Lee

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  • 5 weeks later...

Sorry, I havent' been following this post.

Yes the MCR and Shrike are nearly the same thing. Shrike being the older original design and the MCR is its current name, made by Fightlite.

@har1690
Please do send me the dimensions, I'll take the time to model it up. Is your version of the MCR one of the earlier model of the MCR or new version? I heard the newer versions don't really need it.

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Mine is a Shrike, but not a very early one. Mine has the aluminum feed tray, and rails around the handguard. I dont know all the generations. I am trying to find the billet steel feed tray without going thru fighlite, but it is what it is. I would love to pick up one of the top cover fillers as well. If you make some, please let me know. If you want to PM me and we can talk price and I can give you my info. Thank you for the reply

Lee

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I would be interested in one also,I have an early model like in the 500 range. I believe it was Mark Genovese made these originally, haven’t seen or heard from him for a long time.If I can help at all let me know

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The newer 6th gen upper have a metal insert as well as a modified feed tray.  I posted this here a long time ago but I had a gen 5 that I destroyed and had a horrible time trying to get it fixed. I told them to put a metal insert in, I guess they did on gen 6.

I have the insert as well, it does make a difference feeding.

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Got a picture of that insert? Just wondering if mine is a 5 or 6.

Well 3D printed insert I don't know how well it will handle the abuse. I guess if enough material is backing it and the right material is chosen, it might survive.

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Do any of you know the differences between all the generations. Mine has the aluminum feed tray, and it has the rails around the handguard. It is a shrike.i have searched the interwebs and cant find any reference to what gen had what feature. Big shout out to member WESO, he had a insert and I acquired it. I will be more than happy to take pics measurements etc.

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Thanks boogie1967 and har1690 for the photos.

I find it interesting that there's another section to the side of the feedramp. Wonder what that is for.

Also I find interesting is boogie1967's is yellow. I've only seen photos of them being black.

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On 4/30/2022 at 1:00 PM, taylorwso said:

"does yours have the cooling fins, that was gen 5"

That's correct. I have a Gen 5 with the barrel heat sink installed. Not sure why that feature was dropped? I believe Mark made several variations, the white, yellow and black is what I've seen/had.

 

 

Edited by har1690
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Well last night I pulled out my MCR upper and took some measurements in comparison to the images I was looking at. Height of the feedramps are the only thing I'm guessing what the value should be at.  There might be some trial and error to get it the right height.. Too much and it might cause jams my making it pop out more aggressively downwards.

I'm debating on cutting the corners off like original insert to make it more compatible. Currently I just measured the diameter of the milling bit and used that to calculate the circumference of the edge. 

Also I'm thinking of improving the design to add a stop screw so it can't drift backwards into the gears.. though not sure how well it would hold up with the constant banging of pressure on it from recoil, pawl stripping, and round clicking into place.

One thing I'm not sure about in the design is the curve on the side of the feedramp guide. Not sure what purpose it served.. maybe the insert's feedramp acted like a wall so he needed the other ramp to help the round slide in to place by going around the ramp? I haven't fully investigated it yet so pulling thought from the air.

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Thanks for moving the post. I was feeling kind of weird posting there.

Any case here's a prototype print. It worked in popping that round out, but it failed to allow the pawl to pull the round to the side due to me not cutting the side down enough.. hence no room for the brass neck and bullet to slide pass between the insert and the feed tray.

2TB5SOk.jpg

bcpkGFy.jpg

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Here's my 15th modification. I think this might be the one. 

Feeds in fine, and it gives a slight popup VS without the insert. At least when held upside-down for the video. 

Any case I'll ask one of the people who own a insert  try this. Only thing I may want to do is add a mittle more of a hump to be more aggressive in aiming the tip into the chamber without blocking the feeding of the pawl. 

 

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LOOKS AWESOME

On 5/7/2022 at 10:45 PM, Ryo said:

Thanks for moving the post. I was feeling kind of weird posting there.

Any case here's a prototype print. It worked in popping that round out, but it failed to allow the pawl to pull the round to the side due to me not cutting the side down enough.. hence no room for the brass neck and bullet to slide pass between the insert and the feed tray.

2TB5SOk.jpg

bcpkGFy.jpg

On 4/28/2022 at 3:21 PM, Ryo said:

Got a picture of that insert? Just wondering if mine is a 5 or 6.

does yours have the cooling fins, that was gen 5

 

 

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Ryo

I will send you mine for measurements if you would like. Sent you an email, but didnt hear back. Since I started this whole thing, if you make some for sale, I will purchase one. Let me know if you need to borrow mine. Someone said there is a metal one in the newest uppers. Ive always wondered why people that bought these things over the years dont get a purchase discount for the improvement parts as they come out.

Lee

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4 hours ago, boogie1967 said:

I cant find it, but I got an original, and in it was a small piece of paper that stated use some tape for an exact snug fit. I will post a pic when I round it up.

It was sand paper, that you supposed to use it,  to fit it.  I just slammed min in there and now it wont come out.

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4 hours ago, boogie1967 said:

Ryo

I will send you mine for measurements if you would like. Sent you an email, but didn't hear back. Since I started this whole thing, if you make some for sale, I will purchase one. Let me know if you need to borrow mine. Someone said there is a metal one in the newest uppers. I've always wondered why people that bought these things over the years dont get a purchase discount for the improvement parts as they come out.

Lee

I had thought I send a response back about getting dimensions. Possibly it is in my draft box and I totally spaced and did not press send. What I wanted was the dip height in reference to the bottom.. though I think I have a idea based on the numerous 3D printed inserts I did.

I have never seen a metal insert before.. I saw they cleaned up the top part of the matching of the barrel and trunion.. but nothing to fill the gap.

5 minutes ago, taylorwso said:

It was sand paper, that you supposed to use it,  to fit it.  I just slammed min in there and now it wont come out.

Sorry Taylor about not responding about the fins. i don't think I have cooling fins on mine.

As for the fit, I totally see that it can get really stuck in. I was debating how to handle a things dealing with fitting:
1. I was considering having a little extra material on the sides for having a extremely tight fit. Right now it is tight on mine, but it was designed based on my version. maybe add a hole on the side and have inserts? Or just make it easy and have the person sand it down if too tight..I think I like the idea adding little lines of PETG material for crushing or sanding.
2. Bullet feeding area, between the feeding tray and the final resting place of the round.. the space between the plate and the insert is tight.. I had originally didn't give it much space so no way for the pawls to force it in. Hence I removed more material. I leaned toward removing just a tad more than what mine required just incase it is a tighter fit on some one else's MCR/Shrike.
3. Cam strikes: The insert can be hit by the cam. One of my designs had the CAM hitting it and causing it to not spring back. I removed more material so it gave it space, but I'm thinking of doing a curved cut out just to ensure both cam'd sections won't contact the insert. I was looking at some photos of the inserts and I can see rubs in specific locations where I'm getting rubs. Other option is reduce that side to ensure no contact. It doesn't hurt anything since that side doesn't contact anything.. the contact points is mainly near the middle of the insert where it hits the bottle neck of the case.
4. The higher side of the tray (ejection of the links side) has a section that can contact/crush on to the insert. I might cut it down a bit and had hard foam or something to crush it in place.. or just some thin lines of PETG meant to be crushed. Personally I don't want to add foam to the area. Likely I'll add plastic.. and a note to sand it down for a fit.

One thing I wanted to do but have limited skills of doing.. is adding more material to the curvature. Right now it works but I worry that on someone's MCR, it isn't aggressive enough. I just want to add a hair of material. I'm a self taught SolidWorks user. I'm fortunately my work place allows me to use their CAD system. I may have to ask one of these guys to help me out.

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Back when I got mine from Mark it was slightly loose, so I drilled a small hole in the body of it (side-to-side} and made up a spring and two brass detents that stick out under the spring tension.  It hasn't moved on its own since, but it's easily removable.

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Thanks Dink for the comment. 

Didn't think of using a spring. I just added two thin string wedges to one side which would crush.. But wow that was tough to get out and I did not even pushed it in all the way. If I use my wedge idea I was going to put a screw collet where they can just use a screw to apply pressure to get it out, though likely it would scratch the finish. Other idea was to make a screw down that applied pressure to a internal integrated wedge.

Spring and brass is a good idea since the part shouldn't move when under fire due to the feed plate crushes it upwards. Maybe make it captive using a ING loaded ball plunger.. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

So here's my little update.. This will help retain the part when opening the cover.. allow easier removal as well.

There shouldn't be any issues when in use due to the top cover would be crushing the insert into place. 
I am however still working on some angles to ensure reliability. 

 

20220520-005249-copy-750x1000.jpg

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4 hours ago, Ryo said:

So here's my little update.. This will help retain the part when opening the cover.. allow easier removal as well.

There shouldn't be any issues when in use due to the top cover would be crushing the insert into place. 
I am however still working on some angles to ensure reliability. 

 

20220520-005249-copy-750x1000.jpg

thumbs up

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I am getting close.. just been spinning my wheels on my last print. previous 4 builds worked great, last 2 prints (with new print material) and it became less reliable.  This just means I need to order some of the good print material to keep the reliability of the part. 

Interesting enough empty shell casing allowed me to see the issue due to its expanded neck size. 

So so far I've been testing using PPU 5.56 (bullet), American Eagle M163 (bullet), Lapua reload (bullet), Wolf 223 (brass only), Lake City 5.56 (brass only), Frontier 223 (brass only) for test feeding. Of course this doesn't replace live fire as we all know that's where issues pop up. 

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When I have them ready I'll sign up for being able to sell on this site (been meaning to do that).

I just printed 2 to designs and hope one of them will work better than the other. I expect it to work on both designs but I'm trying to get the one that pops the nosehead of the round more center to the chamber and minimize contact to the feedramp. 

Also I need to work on documentation to make sure you customize it to your MCR/Shrike since there could be differences in tolerance. With my 20+ sample prints, I am getting a good handle on what part does what to the round as it enters the feed slot of the feeding tray. 

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Hmm.. for you guys that MCR's I have a question..

Do you load with the bolt open? I always do. I noticed that with the insert it would dent the casing a small amount due to the bolt riding on the casing due to tight tolerance. I already made a reduced version that reduces the denting to a scratch.. but it gives up a little on the aggressive feeding. 
I don't think the manual says anything about needing to load with the bolt open.. but photos in the manual shows it.

My question is how important is it to you guys to avoid denting the casing near the neck area. I would this it is.. and if it is, what's acceptable level of rubbing.

Note this only occurs on the first round. 2nd round would never have a dent due to the way it is springing into the feed tray.

 

I think if I model the front of the insert a bit more aggressively, but keep the back the same way, it could get the similar results.. but testing required. I wonder if Mark G went through this many iterations to get his angles. I'm curious if his dented the neck of the first round if loading on a close bolt.

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Just a small update:

I've made 2 versions now. One which will dent the neck a bit if it is charged with the BCG closed, and another where it does a minor scratch. The dented one will just reshape itself once fired.. but doesn't dent any more after the first round. (it dents because the insert push the round downwards and the bolt edge scrapes across it. I'm thinking the more aggressive one is going to work the best. Both I like the way they are working.. at least manually. 

I should be receiving a actual Mark G insert to just compare, but I suspect from photos I've seen, it will be quite aggressive like my neck denting one. It's going to be an interesting comparison.

Edited by Ryo
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  • 1 month later...

Been a while since I posted about these.

boogie1967 has been so kind to lend me his insert to look at and compare to the one I designed from the ground up. I added some changes to mine that I saw was better in the original which was to minimize the denting of the brass if cycling in a round when the bolt is closed.

Any case I have a good contender that is more aggressive in the angle than the original that was lent to me. I really like the feel of it ripping the round off the links into the chamber.
I did my best to create a model the original one so I now can produce a clone of the original if someone wants it.

My next step is to test fire. As we all know without live fire, we can never know if the design is sound. 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Finally did a test run and it was successful. I need to examine the brass more closely to see any issues but picking them up I didn't notice anything. The part it self didn't look worn/damage but really didn't shoot enough rounds to see long term longevity. I did both my version and the clone of the original part. 

Proof of life. (my version) 

https://vimeo.com/735885372

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  • 1 month later...

I got one of the inserts that member Ryo is making. I have to say the quality of craftsmanship is commendable. It is nicer than the original that was made quite a while back and has a ball detent to keep it tight in the upper. If you are thinking of getting one, do it. it is really nice and I am stoked that he is re introducing these. Very stand up honest guy as well.

Edited by boogie1967
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