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120 day brace “amnesty” to form 1’s


Thumpy
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This sucks.  Those of us who played by the rules, filed a Form 1 and put real shoulder stocks on our PDWs had to pay a $200 tax,  The people who thought they were being clever and sticking it to the ATF by circumventing the rules now get to register theirs for free?  It may be expeditious but it's not right.

This influx should add another 6 months or so to the e-file waiting queue

 

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Edited by StrangeRanger
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I have a lot of SBRs…and a lot of non SBRS that I planned to SBR at some point…if everyone were to file a form 1 for every gun one had as part of this amnesty that would really clog up the system. what about bare receivers…I have a lot of those too…

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I believe its going to be challenged in the courts and there will be a stay before the 120 days

it will be tied up for a while in the courts.

ATF had already put out letters saying it was legal now they are changing there tone. Not gonna look go for their case!

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6 hours ago, StrangeRanger said:

This sucks.  Those of us who played by the rules, filed a Form 1 and put real shoulder stocks on our PDWs had to pay a $200 tax,  The people who thought they were being clever and sticking it to the ATF by circumventing the rules now get to register theirs for free?  It may be expeditious but it's not right.

This influx should add another 6 months or so to the e-file waiting queue

 

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Well our founding fathers didn’t play by the rules… an they got a whole new country because of it lol so maybe there is something to learn from the past! 

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6 hours ago, Thumpy said:

Well our founding fathers didn’t play by the rules… an they got a whole new country because of it lol so maybe there is something to learn from the past! 

There's a more recent lesson about defying the government c. 1861-65.  Substantially different outcome

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11 hours ago, davises said:

I have a lot of SBRs…and a lot of non SBRS that I planned to SBR at some point…if everyone were to file a form 1 for every gun one had as part of this amnesty that would really clog up the system. what about bare receivers…I have a lot of those too…

cant do receiver, just sbrs with braces already

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4 hours ago, taylorwso said:

cant do receiver, just sbrs with braces already

Not that I would, as I think in the long run who knows how the wind will blow…I.e. someone will later decide that braced pistols should not have been allowed to be registered as SBRs without paying the tax…but I imagine there will be a lot folks who’s receivers suddenly identify as braced pistols. After all, if we are supposed to accept that boys can decide they are girls and girls can decide they are boys, why couldn’t a receiver identify as a full fledged braced pistol?

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As I understand it if the original paperwork filed by the manufacturer lists the type of firearm as a rifle receiver, then no matter what you do to it, it remains a rifle.  Put on a short barrel and remove the stock and it does not become a pistol, it becomes an unregistered SBR.  If the original paperwork lists it as a pistol then you can remove the brace and it becomes a pistol again; or you can add a brace/stock and paper it as an SBR

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1 hour ago, StrangeRanger said:

As I understand it if the original paperwork filed by the manufacturer lists the type of firearm as a rifle receiver, then no matter what you do to it, it remains a rifle.  Put on a short barrel and remove the stock and it does not become a pistol, it becomes an unregistered SBR.  If the original paperwork lists it as a pistol then you can remove the brace and it becomes a pistol again; or you can add a brace/stock and paper it as an SBR

There's no such thing as a "rifle" or "pistol" receiver, until a receiver is built with an upper, it's an "other" - receiver. If you build it with a stock, then it's a rifle if you build it without one or with a brace then it's a pistol, end of. 

Edited by b_san
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1 hour ago, StrangeRanger said:

As I understand it if the original paperwork filed by the manufacturer lists the type of firearm as a rifle receiver, then no matter what you do to it, it remains a rifle.  Put on a short barrel and remove the stock and it does not become a pistol, it becomes an unregistered SBR.  If the original paperwork lists it as a pistol then you can remove the brace and it becomes a pistol again; or you can add a brace/stock and paper it as an SBR

I see where this might go.  Someone slaps a brace on a rifle and files the freebie form 1.  ATF denies and comes to collect the rifle instead.

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1 hour ago, b_san said:

There's no such thing as a "rifle" or "pistol" receiver, until a receiver is built with an upper, it's an "other" - receiver. If you build it with a stock, then it's a rifle if you build it without one or with a brace then it's a pistol, end of. 

So the original manufacturer doesn't specify the type of firearm?  Then why did ATF get their panties in a bunch when Thompson Center started making carbine barrel and shoulder stock kits for the Contender? The main thrust of the suit was the possibility of making an SBR.  There was series of lawsuits back and forth and SCOTUS eventually found in T/C's favor because of some vague wording with regards to "make" vs. "assemble" so T/C was not required to pay the $200 Form 2 tax on such receivers.  Also and largely forgotten in the intervening 30 years is that ATF actually required T/C to serialize any receiver sold with a carbine kit with a letter C appended to the S/N in an attempt to prevent someone assembling them as a handgun.

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21 hours ago, StrangeRanger said:

So the original manufacturer doesn't specify the type of firearm?  Then why did ATF get their panties in a bunch

they do specify but it can be a "receiver/frame" which is neither a pistol or rifle.

 

The ATF tried to argue their BS about being able to make a sbr just because you have a short barrel with stock in the same package.

 

as long as you can get whatever config into something "legal" then its fine, either pistol or rifle

 

 

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On 1/14/2023 at 5:39 PM, StrangeRanger said:

There's a more recent lesson about defying the government c. 1861-65.  Substantially different outcome

Lol I Disagree. The south continue doing what they wanted for a very long time after that.

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On 1/16/2023 at 1:49 PM, taylorwso said:

they do specify but it can be a "receiver/frame" which is neither a pistol or rifle.

Not only "can" it be listed as a Frame or Receiver but it "must" be listed that way in your bound book or you'll get dinged by the IOI during an inspection. 

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/how-should-licensee-record-their-records-transfer-frame-or-receiver-unlicensed-purchaser

A licensee must record the type of firearm as a “frame” or “receiver” (as applicable) in the acquisition and disposition (A&D) record and on the ATF Form 4473. The licensee must also include in any record the make, model, and serial number of the frame or receiver.

 

As a frame or receiver is neither a shotgun nor a rifle, a licensee is prohibited from selling or delivering a frame or receiver to any individual the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe is less than 21 years of age.

 

[18 U.S.C. 922(b)(5), 27 CFR 478 .11]

Edited by b_san
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  1. Once the firearm is registered according to the guidelines of the 120 day amnesty, may the firearm have a stock on it instead of a brace? If it's an SBR, my understanding any temporary changes, barrel length or in this case replacing the "illegal" arm brace would be legal provided it could be returned to the registered configuration.
  2. Is engraving of the maker's name city and state required?
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On 1/20/2023 at 7:46 AM, Rebel Rifle Ordnance LLC said:
  1. Once the firearm is registered according to the guidelines of the 120 day amnesty, may the firearm have a stock on it instead of a brace? If it's an SBR, my understanding any temporary changes, barrel length or in this case replacing the "illegal" arm brace would be legal provided it could be returned to the registered configuration.
  2. Is engraving of the maker's name city and state required?

yes its a sbr IAW their wording, and it allowed with a pending form. 

no engraving hence the pictures of the serial number

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dang i just form 3 some……….

So your telling me i can form 1 some stuff and don’t have to mess it up with engraving? Also i can put a real stock and tango down??

I thought there was some thing in there if a ffl took something in that was improperly marked the ffl was going to have to fix it or some nonsense.

 I feel like my dad in 1968…..registration? their coming to get’em boys!!

 

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