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NFA to end???


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my guess is that even if the law is overturned (very unlikely), Congress would quickly pass a new law which would be similar to the old law.  No way that NFA items would be uncontrolled - Democrat and Republican would not let this happen.

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Ain’t a chance in hell. That being said, I really wish it would end and I think the NFA and FOPA is blatantly unconstitutional.

Damn near every politician already thinks you can’t own an MG, regardless of party.

There’s only been a few court cases since 1934 but they never went anywhere. Unfortunately, I think the NFA is here to stay. Unfortunately, MG’s ain’t common use. 

Edited by KickStand
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We can pray it all gets repealed. As far as the “not in common use” one could argue that the amount of arrests for illegal mgs is proving in fact that they are in common use because the atf has said “the Glock sears are everywhere” which if something is everywhere that seems pretty common use to me. Also they have ruled the FRT is a mg that would bump numbers up where one could argue in common use as well… There is also one court case arguing the legality of them not issuing stamps once paperwork is field. We will see what comes of it… but the world is changing people of my generation are not the same ones of yours… the NFA will be repealed in my life time I’m sure of it.

Edited by Thumpy
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Just be careful what you wish for....as stated above it could be repealed then Congress passes something even worse, to the point you’ll then be crying “wish we’d left well enough alone” personally sometimes, tho it sucks, it’s better to let sleeping dogs lay there. 

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19 hours ago, Got Uzi said:

Just be careful what you wish for....as stated above it could be repealed then Congress passes something even worse, to the point you’ll then be crying “wish we’d left well enough alone” personally sometimes, tho it sucks, it’s better to let sleeping dogs lay there. 

This is exactly what I was going to say.  Look what happened to NY state after the concealed carry law.  They went full crazy on their citizens.  If it’s repealed they will update the tax and make it 100k per gun or whatever number they come up with.  
I don’t like it but would be ok staying where we are and not losing more.

Edited by pa123guns
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Change is never good.  Remember the FOPA, it seemed like a good idea? (OK, not to me but...)  Then they slipped in the hughes amendment, did a fake voice vote, and here we are.  Product capped at 180K and declining as guns are lost, broken, and registrations lost.  That was at a time when there were a few honest politicians.  Look at what they do now, and imagine how they would screw us?   Inflation is good, there is no recession, you can pick your gender.....or just make one up, climate change, etc.

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I am not counting on the NFA being repealed. Seems like wishful thinking. Given the statements in Biden's platform I would tend to think that if he had support the NFA would be expanded to include a whole new class of semi auto rifles. Good thing he does not have the political support.

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I am not holding my breath its going to be repealed but if it the NFA law was repealed via some judicial "hail mary",  it could still be argued that even absent the NFA 34 legal regulations (registration, regulation, and taxation) that new machineguns would still be illegal under Title 18 - § 922 - Unlawful acts - 922(o) amendment to the GCA.

So maybe you could buy and sell a transferable machinegun without the NFA transfer process anymore but 922(o) still states that machinegun manufactured after the act are illegal to possess.

If again there was some way that both the NFA Title 26 registration, taxation and transfer provisions and the Title 18 - 922(o) provisions were both struck down there is already a supreme court case (Farmer v Higgins) stating that machineguns have no second amendment protection.  There are also multiple US District Court Cases as well (Watson and Hollis) where the same conclusion was reached. Even Heller mentions restrictions on dangerous and usual weapons, albeit doesn't mention machineguns specifically.  So I don't see a huge legislative hurdle to pass new and more onerous restrictions on machineguns.

Given that probably 90%+ of the US population is of the opinion that machineguns and destructive devices should be illegal I don't doubt for an instant that should the NFA and/or 922(o) be struck down that a new ban will quickly be passed and I suspect that whatever the bipartisan crooks in DC cook up that will probably make the current NFA look like a picnic in the park. 

Even with the current right leaning makeup of the court I just don't see them allowing for almost unfettered access to machineguns and destructive devices.

The real irony would be that somebody gets the actual NFA registration/taxation/transfer schema struck down but 922(o) stays in place so it doesn't even get you new machineguns.  The resultant knee-jerk legislative reaction to cash and carry transferable machineguns in addition to grenade launches, silencers, and "sawed off" shotguns leads to a new complete ban on all categories of NFA firearms making the whole situation overall worse than it is today.

I would love to get the genie in a bottle three wishes and use to the first wish to make all guns laws go away and the second one to make it permanent and irreversible, but the realist in me says as much as the current regulations suck, we are probably lucky to have access to any of this stuff at all and rocking the boat on these category of firearms has a not insignificant risk of backfiring on everyone.

Seems to me that there are better and potentially safer options to chip away at the NFA via reducing the tax to $5 for all categories, establishing a Brady style maximum transfer time frame approval provision, removing the more innocuous SBR and/or "two grip" AOW pistol category from the NFA without going whole hog and the material risk of a serious legislative backlash as a result. If you are successful with some limited steps on tax, transfer time frames, and maybe SBRs, then go after suppressors next, etc. 

Edited by jbntex
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We may one day see some leniency on suppressors, Maybe Short barreled rifles & shotguns but I 100% doubt they’ll ever allow any new machineguns to be manufactured for us civilians. It’d be political suicide for any politician to be in favor of it. Not to mention, There wouldn’t be enough support to advocate for it. We’re a really small group & rare breed, Haha
 

Its a safe bet to say, What we have on the registry is all we’re ever going to have in terms of FA for civilians and I’d say we’re lucky to still have those. I’m worried some wack job will commit a major crime one day with a transferable mg & bring scrutiny to us very small group of owners, collectors & enthusiasts, It may be over then. I certainly hope it never happens but I’m sure at some point its possible. 

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I want the NFA gone more than anyone, but something would take its place and to be honest.... i don't trust a single politician from either party to have our backs and pass something that actually makes sense. Politicians are all talk and rarely have a spine. They vote for what's in their best interest to stay in power, not what is right for their constituents. 

Machine guns aren't in common use because they (US Government) have artificially limited the quantity in the public marketplace. If they weren't so expensive more people would have them. 

I'd be happy with the ability to manufacture and add to the registry. 

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Shamelessly stolen.

Three guys stumble upon a bottle on the beach. They open it and a genie pops out and says, "you each get one wish."

First guy wishes that all democrats and their types leave the country and cannot ever come back. 

Genie blinks and all democrats and their types leave the country and cannot ever come back. 

Second guy wishes that all the laws and policies they passed are reversed.

Genie blinks and all the laws and policies they passed are are reversed.

Third guy says, you mean to tell me that all democrats and their types leave the country and cannot ever come back and all the laws and policies they passed are reversed.

Genie says, "Yes. What is your wish?"

Third guy thinks about it and says, I'll have round of Bud Light for me and my friends.

Edited by Waffen Und Bier
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The best thing to happen the opposite way was the GOPA. The Gun Owners Protection Act was a bill that actually did what the name said. For

example, you could legally ship and order ammo through the mail!! I was still in school ag he time, and my uncle ex army military got me into firearms in a bigger way. 
 

the only thing that tripped up things for NFA was and overzealous democrat on a mission, and there was no line item veto. There is of course many thousands of good lines to the bill mixed with that 1 closing the registry for civilians. 
 

Reagan had met with the NRA and others before signing. He did not have ant to ban anything. He was just encouraged to sign as jot to lose all the good parts. Of course shortly there after line item veto bill was passed to cover future eventualities like this. 

With Trump, there was the best hope for change. For example, he was to get the hearing protection act legislation through, so suppressors would be taken off the registry and widely available as in Europe shooting sports for example. 
 


 

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On 9/10/2022 at 10:19 AM, gamebit21 said:

The best thing to happen the opposite way was the GOPA. The Gun Owners Protection Act was a bill that actually did what the name said. For

example, you could legally ship and order ammo through the mail!! I was still in school ag he time, and my uncle ex army military got me into firearms in a bigger way. 
 

the only thing that tripped up things for NFA was and overzealous democrat on a mission, and there was no line item veto. There is of course many thousands of good lines to the bill mixed with that 1 closing the registry for civilians. 
 

Reagan had met with the NRA and others before signing. He did not have ant to ban anything. He was just encouraged to sign as jot to lose all the good parts. Of course shortly there after line item veto bill was passed to cover future eventualities like this. 

With Trump, there was the best hope for change. For example, he was to get the hearing protection act legislation through, so suppressors would be taken off the registry and widely available as in Europe shooting sports for example. 
 


 

I wish the Hughes amendment had been as short lived as the line item veto that was passed in 1996 and was ruled unconstitutional in 1997 by the supreme court. Unfortunately the the number of machine gun enthusiasts is very small in the arena of politics and never likely to see Hughes repealed 

As for Reagan he is in my opinion overrated as a pro second amendment politician. As the Governor of California, he signed the Mulford act establishing California's first gun control law 19 years before he signed the firearms Owners Protection Act. He signed FOPA banning machine-guns and setting the precedent for the banning of entire classes of guns. Finally when his term was over he publicly supported both the Brady Act and the 1994 assault weapons ban. Not stellar in my book

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Jeff S....you miss spelled a word in your post...its not "could" be worse but "would" be worse....that "c" should be a "w" LOL 

In all seriousness tho, I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who sees this as a bad idea.  What ruined the NFA at this point, plus makes people want to repeal it is the prices and people using machine guns to "hide money" as investments.  When that happens, it all ends badly.  I've seen it happen with antique tractors, hit and miss engines, and vintage cars.  When big money guys get into it, prices skyrocket for the "good stuff" and everything else goes up the same percentage....sounds like inflation don't it?  Now that being said, I've watch the market on said items drop in the past 5-10 years, with the exception of certain car types.  The "brass era" cars have taken a hit, partly because the prices got so high and no one could touch them, or that those wanting to buy them are dying off.  To use the arguement "we need to repeal the NFA so MG's will be cheaper" is the same logic as me saying "Dodge needs to make the 1968 GTX again cuz I want one but they are too much money....."  

Maybe I'm looking at this wrong, but I kinda doubt it.

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Dear sir,

 

     I agree with you 100%. Principle alone is ultimately what matters the most which equates to truer liberty and freedom. 

     I am in my forties, and you at 26 in your twenties, represent the correct attitudes and apparently the work ethic and values that made the USA Great in the first place. 
 

     No disrespect meant towards you, I just seriously ask, how many people regardless of age or life situation, will actually stand with someone like you and me? Yes, right is right no matter what to me. I only ask because it just seems to me that the numbers just are not there. 
 

     Everything aside, it is hard to argue that people were more self reliant not to many years ago. Every tool and process and technology can be used for good or evil. Ultimately the individual has to make decisions. 
 

     In general as cities become mega cities and things are more provided and supplied then acquired and worked for,  the greater the percentage of the population becomes complacent and dependent. Also people value things less the less they work for them. It is just human nature and psychology. 
 

     In the long and short of it, everyone is free to do what they wish in the bounds of the laws. IE. The quote “your freedom ends where someone else’s nose begins.” At the same time though, 100% of people break down into some basic types. 1-2% are lunatics, about 10% type A personalities (ie. seals, leaders, extroverts), 30% hardcore liberal as you can be, 30% hardcore conservative as you can be, and about 28% are those central type people that just fill in the times. 
 

     In all this mix again, can you really run a campaign of let’s make open 2A Rights included common use military weapons as the constitution supports? All able body males who apply at say 17 / 18, have a government safe / strongbox on their house. In it you will have an auto rifle and handgun for for training and reservist service like in Switzerland? 
 

     The tide is flowing back to a common sense law and order. Yet there are just to many liberals and extreme view socialists in places to make allot of noises in the media. It is just hard to get the votes you need to support these bills and repeal the NFA for example. 
 

     Yet the Path of Rome seems to be ours….

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