secondofangle Posted January 3, 2022 Report Share Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) Hey, guys - wanting to get some advice on a dilemma I face. And please if you want to be helpful, I don't need to hear how stupid or naive you think I've been, just tell me how you would proceed from where I find myself. I paid $40K to a seller in Florida in May/June 2021 for a DLO frame. Seller is a physician with a clear online footprint (I am too), and I checked references before sale. The DLO is/was on a F3 at his dealer - he never took possession of it. New F3 to my dealer submitted after my payment was received. Rejected by examiner because of some sort of address discrepancy on the seller's dealer's SOT. The plan around September was for SOT to resolve that discrepancy and resubmit. The address thing has apparently been resolved so early November they resubmitted the F3. There is no word on the status as of last week - "still pending". I have been in periodic communication with the seller, but not his dealer until today (edited to add below) .Seller says he has several other items trying to get through F3s and F4s with same dealer, some successful some not. (Seller's one reference I contacted before sale confirmed that he's sold numerous items in 2021 - he's liquidating a sizable collection.) Seller earlier offered to refund my money; I declined b/c I've been looking for one for years and I have reason to believe if I find one again it will cost me more than $40k. I have seen pics of the item, and of the F3 it's on with the transferree listed being the dealer my seller is using and who has possession of the item. I just called the dealer (Mark at Naples Guns and Ammo in Naples FL). He answered the phone right away and seemed to remember my item but offered few specifics. Seemed busy/frazzled. Said mine didn't go through but another several did go through with the SOT that was originally submitted; and regardless that the "address discrepancy" had been resolved and he expects it to go through this time "but with ATF you never know." Said he had heard from seller about a week ago too (when I had emailed asking for an update), but "I don't have the paperwork in front of me and can't tell you anything more - when it comes through in the mail that's when I'll know." Seemed like a nice enough guy but did not offer to go out of his way to reassure me with any hard data or anything, which is at least a little odd. My inclination is to ask the seller to temporarily refund 50% of the sale price until the F3 is approved and I repay it before item ships to my dealer. That way he has "skin in the game" too - right now I'm the only one with skin in the game. Thoughts on this? Any other options? Thanks! SOA Edited January 3, 2022 by secondofangle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM in La. Posted January 3, 2022 Report Share Posted January 3, 2022 That sounds like a reasonable request. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bwana Posted January 4, 2022 Report Share Posted January 4, 2022 Is form 3 done with paper submission or electronically ("e-form 3")? Not much that ANYONE can do if ATF delays forms... Not sure that pressuring dealer will do anything since it sounds like it is at ATF. Your dealer can call ATF to verify that the form is pending. If electronic submittal - usually much faster - your dealer can view status online. It is frustrating when ATF delays transfers. There is no rhyme or reason why some transfers with same address go through and others don't. Only suggestion is to have your dealer verify transfer status. If ATF doesn't have record of resubmitted form then resubmit with e-form. ATF loses forms sometimes. Hang in there. Trust but verify. Getting $$ might feel good but likely will not move anything faster. Good luck! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattnh Posted January 4, 2022 Report Share Posted January 4, 2022 You and the seller both sound like reasonable folks. Hopefully the F3 goes through in the next few weeks. Odd the FFL/SOT isn't using electronic Form3s for a super simple/quick turnaround... Sometimes things go sideways on an NFA transfer despite everyone's best intensions (e.g. lost form, unexpected BATFE delay/rejection, item lost/damaged in mail, etc). I'm sure the seller feels pretty bad about the situation, but sounds like he has minimal juice with his local FFL/SOT (The SOT isn't going to be highly motivated by just a transfer fee). There is little the seller can personally do to make things right other that offering a full refund. Talk to the seller. I'd just pick a reasonable date a few months in the future & get a full refund if it doesn't clear by then. -- Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondofangle Posted January 4, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2022 great advice thanks guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron in Mohnton Pa Posted January 4, 2022 Report Share Posted January 4, 2022 I have had forms for transferables returned for things deemed incorrect on them by examiners (when in fact they were correct). The only thing you can do is correct or try to meet their satisfaction and resubmit..... So these things can and do occur....Based on what your saying it does not sound like anything is amiss ..inconvenient for sure though.. As mentioned above there is little the FFL can do other than reassure you that he resubmitted the paperwork and the ball is rolling and in the ATF's court. I would give it a little more time .... I can also understand your concerns though. I don't think your out of line for asking for partial refund as reassurance being that these discrepancies have come up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondofangle Posted January 16, 2022 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2022 Another member has contacted me with identical problems. If you are in the same boat as us, please DM me so we can compare notes and progress of lack thereof LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron in Mohnton Pa Posted January 18, 2022 Report Share Posted January 18, 2022 @secondofangle , lets us know how this shakes out then. Curious now as to what the hold up / issue is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondofangle Posted February 23, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2022 (edited) Guys - this has not yet been resolved. SOT sold business and/or changed address down the street. SOT paperwork is not in order. F3s, mine and another buyer's (whom I know) are held up, can't go through. SOT is not trying hard, if at all, to remedy the issue. My local SOT called ATF and they said if the F3 SOT papers not in order, not valid, etc, it can be transferred on an F4 to another SOT/FFL. That's what I've proposed to the seller, to ask his SOT if he will go transfer it to a local dealer on an F4, and once that e-file goes through, immediately e-file an F3 and start over. Looks like an F4 can go to an out of state dealer, just with a delay SOA Edited February 24, 2022 by secondofangle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondofangle Posted February 24, 2022 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2022 (edited) I have asked the parties involved to, in the next 2 weeks, complete F4 paperwork for transfer to my local SOT. Fingers crossed. Edited February 24, 2022 by secondofangle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sempfi1 Posted March 4, 2022 Report Share Posted March 4, 2022 Goodluck OP. You are a patient man. I hope this all works out for you sir. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secondofangle Posted March 9, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2022 here's the follow-up for those who haven't seen it: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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