Doesn't this definition of "machine gun" include submachine guns?

[ThompsonMan]

https://web.archive.org/web/20030824043643/http://www.saami.org/glossary/display.cfm?letter=M

Aren't submachine guns included in this definition by the Sporting Arms and Manufacturers' Institute?

Edited April 1, 2020 by ThompsonMan

[MontanaRenegade86]

Let us assume:

1.) A "machinegun" is a firearm that fires automatically (or is capable of select-fire).

2.) A "sub-machinegun" is a smaller handgun caliber firearm that fires automatically (or is capable of select-fire).

Therefore:

A sub-machinegun is also a machinegun.

Seems logical.

What does everybody else think?

-Kristopher

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by MontanaRenegade86

[mike todd]

NO QUESTION !    leaving the ATF out of this,  ANY firearm that continues to fire with one pull of the trigger is indeed a "MACHINE GUN", size / caliber / power has no bearing. after THAT has been established , other terms like "sub" can be used to classify or separate groups for discussion etc.

[ThompsonMan]

8 hours ago, mike todd said:

NO QUESTION !    leaving the ATF out of this,  ANY firearm that continues to fire with one pull of the trigger is indeed a "MACHINE GUN", size / caliber / power has no bearing. after THAT has been established , other terms like "sub" can be used to classify or separate groups for discussion etc.

So it is factually accurate to call a Tommy Gun a “machine gun”? The models used by police and criminals so not the replicas?

 

 

 

Edited April 2, 2020 by ThompsonMan

[MontanaRenegade86]

4 hours ago, ThompsonMan said:

So it is factually accurate to call a Tommy Gun a “machine gun”? The models used by police and criminals so not the replicas?

 

 

 

Yes, provided it has the ability to fire automatically.

I agree with Mike. Once one has defined what a machinegun is, he can then look at different categories of machineguns: light machineguns, heavy machineguns, submachineguns, automatic rifles, battle rifles, machine pistols, personal defense weapons, and the like. 

-Kristopher

[mike todd]

"TOMMY GUN "  when applied to the Thompson machine gun , has been the subject of much discussion over the years. it was actually applied on a few examples towards the end of production at auto ordnance both 28 and M-1. I believe it originated in EUROPE following the large purchase by the BRITISH . propaganda was VERY important and commando activity exploited in all the news reels and press with a drum fed "tommy" getting top billing. 

[TD.]

The word "TOMMY" (not TOMMY GUN") was trademarked by the Auto-Ordnance Corporation during World War II. The TOMMY GUN markings are generally found on Model of 1928 Savage manufactured Thompson guns in the mid 100,000 to mid 200,000 serial number range, but not on all guns in this limited range. My story on all of the Auto-Ordnance trademarks, including the word TOMMY, can be found in a 2010 issue of Small Arms Review magazine. It is one of my favorite Thompson stories! 

https://www.smallarmsreview.com/display.article.cfm?idarticles=527

[mike todd]

TD. I would agree with that completely. I bow my head to all you guys that have the time to research past data etc for the "real deal" and those that need it. I'm just an old guy that gathered this info by being there and doing that along side the early pioneers of recreational NFA use and collecting. add that to the loss of brain cells due to age and my data bank degrades even more. again, I lay no claim to being the final word about any of this stuff, just enjoy sharing what little I can with the goal of whetting interest . without a decent computer being available to an individual in the early 60's there was no way to record the history and fact's of the more than 200 + nfa weapons I owned and used . In addition to them, my collection also included every variation of the SMLE manufactured from 1899 thru 1953 more than 600 rifles. the term "TOMMY" was an enduring expression of respect of the Commonwealth Combatant , and sorry to say I have no idea why nor did I care at the time I just followed suit. maybe someone has that in their electronic data and would like to share it?