ShadowDoc

MG's as an investment

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Hi all,

I am posting at the request of my wife.  We recently had a conversation in which I told her that I consider machine gun purchases to be very different from purchases of regular firearms.  I consider machine guns to be a tangible asset class that can provide an experience in addition to merely being an investment vehicle like non-tangible assets (e.g. an index fund).  In contrast, I don't consider non-NFA firearms to be investments.  Non-NFA firearms may maintain a relatively stable value over time, but I don't purchase them with the intention of selling them in the future (if needed) or potentially making money.

My wife sees machine guns as just incredibly expensive toys.  She maintains that no person would honestly consider them to be investments.  She challenged me to find at least five people who would view them as tangible investments.

Thoughts?  Are there five people who consider machine guns to be investment vehicles rather than just objects of desire?

Thank you.

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Lots of variables. 

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Posted (edited)

I was able to get my wife to go along with that thinking. I was able to get a couple of HK Sears and an M16 out of the deal. I told her I was 60(couple years ago) and I would like to enjoy myself for a bit before the end (raised 4 kids and got them thru school). Was able to put everything in a spread sheet and she can sell the stuff when I pass(She is 11 years younger). Told her I could always buy a Vette or other sports car but good luck getting anything near what I paid for it after I was gone. She was OK with that so Im all good :) 

Edited by tobrooks

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PS worked for my brother too!

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Posted (edited)

I view silver, gold, and other precious metals as investments. I view full autos as Constitutionally protected arms. 

This is not meant as a slam against anybody in particular, but I have a rather dim view of those who consider machine guns to be investments. The reason for that is because many who hold the investment viewpoint believe that these weapons should continue to be heavily restricted so as to protect the "value" of these firearms. The restrictive laws create a limited supply and high demand and thus price them out of the range of the common man. I do not believe it is the governments prerogative to protect our investments but to instead protect our Natural Rights. 

Just my thoughts, your opinion may  differ. 

And before I get accused of being a typical whiny millennial, I have spent over $50k in full autos. :D

Anyway, go for it. I think we can both agree that regardless of our reasons, machine guns are freakin' cool. 

Edited by MontanaRenegade86
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Well I have spent more than that but have no objection to them being removed from NFA. I don't think that will happen at least in my lifetime but if it did I would be ok with taking the hit I would and buying some really cool toys that are out of my price range. More $200 sears, Cheap HK receiver guns, HK21's, M60's and SAWS. Where do I sign up :) 

As you said and im 100% with you "I think we can both agree that regardless of our reasons, machine guns are freakin' cool.!!!!!!

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I wish everything I thought was a sound investment, did as well as my H&K sear!

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I DONT AGREE WITH MUCH OF THE ABOVE but that's the way its posed to be in this country !  all you guys are thinking since 1986 and as a matter of fact the overall values of MG's increased more than you will believe from 1965 until 1980 . the category index increased more than 2000% ! colt Thompson in 65- $250 / 80-7/10,000 !  1917A1 =65-$300 /1980-$8000.  PICKS WORLD CURRENCY DID A STUDY ON THE MACHINE GUN MARKET IN 1979 AND THE YEARLY AVERAGE INCREASE IN VALUE WAS GREATER THAN 145% . actually I never cared its what I did and I paid whatever I had to  in order to get it. never thought about how much I could get for it if I got tired of it. to me getting rid of a machine gun , is just like sitting on a toilet after a meal. I don't want to waste the time and effort, but its going to happen so allow the "movement" to proceed.  thank GOD other things worked out well for me and I never had to think much about the money  AND I SURE AS HELL DIDNT CARE WHAT SOME WALKING TRASH RECEPATACLE THOUGHT! lt was kinda nice giving them something worth while to bitch about for a change. a good point in fact is the modern perception in this world that created $20,000. MG-34's and a piece of aluminum with a spring auto sear at $30,000. WHAT GIVES YOU THE MOST JOY TO LOOK AT?


I only accept postal money orders. contact me DIRECTLY before sending any funds                                           email  myoldiron@outlook.com        

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WHAT GIVES YOU THE MOST JOY TO LOOK AT?  That one is easy(for the moment) Mike-My HK 21, does that count for getting out of my short pants :) Nice to see you posting lately always enjoy your prospective and knowledge!! Thanks Tommy 

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This ones a hard one for me because when I was in high school I remember seeing mac10s for 2000-3000 thinking to my self man that’s not that much money I could buy one after a summer of mowing yards when I turned 21 almost two years ago I looked again saw the macs where around 6-8k and thought for get that for a couple grand more I can buy a ac556 and have a rifle witch is what I did... so would I say they work as a investment yes because I’ve literly seen them double in a short amount of time... but I don’t believe in them being investments my self if the nfa was repealed tomorow and the value of my mg went down to 500 bucks I wouldn’t care I believe every one in America should be able to own one if they want I also don’t believe in the any gun laws but I follow them because I like my gun rights and prison is not verry high on my list of places to have a vacation at. I’d say mgs could be an investment if you look at it as such but it’s a rather risky one if some one gets in office and says no more mgs then your investment goes to zero and most of you would probly hand your property in I can promise you I would not but most of you would. Or if the nfa gets repealed it could drop to pretty close to zero so man idk if I’d consider it a investment or not Ik it’s a wonderful place holder for my money keeps me from spending it on stupid stuff. And it allows me to enjoy something I love todo and allows me to let other people shoot there first fullauto every time I take it out deep down one of the coolest things todo the smile on there face after shooting it is makes me smile as big as I did the first time I shot fullauto.

For your sake I’d tell your wife they are a great investment so you can buy them.... probly don’t show her the first half... 

 

To shadowDocs wife machineguns are great investments can’t go wrong with them they out preform the stock market way better value and enjoyment out of them then a old car witch have dropped some in recent years in value!!!  

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Thank you for the responses.  I should probably clarify my post a bit.  

Some of my early exposure to firearms was through a junior smallbore rifle club back in the 1980's.  After being involved with the club for several years, we found out that one of the guys who ran the club was probably one of the largest machine gun dealers in the country.  He had roughly 400 machine guns in his collection at the time.  That gentleman is long since deceased; however, participation in that club sparked my interest in firearms.

The question is really about do you see machine guns differently from regular firearms?  Do you consider them to be objects of desire or are they additionally tangible assets which can also be enjoyed? 

For example, I consider most of my regular firearms to be a hobby.  I buy guns because I find them to be extremely interesting.  I actually get to shoot them far less often than I wish.  At the end of the day though, they are basically toys.  I don't have an expectation when I buy one that I will ever get my money back.

For me, a machine gun is different.  Yes, they have all the appeal of a regular firearm (and more); however, I would not be able to justify one (at the price premium over regular firearms they demand) for myself if I didn't see them as scarce assets that will likely appreciate in value over time.  

Yes, I absolutely wish machine guns were no different than any other firearm.  I would gladly see the Hughes ammendment repealed and their value drop.  Being pragmatic, compared to other non-tangible or tangible asset classes, I see full autos as having at least as much upside as most other asset classes.  All asset classes have risk.  I have lost money in the stock market (and I cannot enjoy a brokerage account directly).  Precious metals, cars, etc. all have their own risks, and frankly, I don't have nearly the personal interest in any other tangible asset class.

Let me ask the question this way, would you buy a machine gun if you knew for certain that five years from now it would be worth less than half what you paid for it?  My wife compares a full auto to a new sports car.  In that light, I consider a new sports car to be a toy while a machine gun is an enjoyable tangible asset.

Thanks!

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Everybody has different interest. For me it was a bucket list thing. I have been interested in cars and guns all my life. Had 7 Corvettes and lots of guns and 1 Sendra M16(paid around $3k for the M16 if I remember correctly) before I/we had kids. We had one birth child and adopted 3 other children. After the children started coming along it was by by to the M16, most of the guns and hello mimi van. Right before I turned 60 and the financial burden(not really what I would call a burden because I love all my children) I thought man I would like to check off some bucket list stuff. I looked at a new vette but it was hard getting in and out of that thing as I was not as agile as I was when I was younger , bad knees ect. There was other stuff I thought about but was still very interested in MG's so I went that route and am very pleased. If I had more interest in the Corvettes I would have went that direction knowing full well in 5 years it would be worth about half what I paid for it. The $ gain/loss never played really into the decision. I really enjoy the MG's I have. Just got my first beltfed (HK21) and not sure if I can stop without an M60 though the ATF wait time really puts me on the fence. So in the end Im very happy with the choices I made, my wife is ok with it so I guess it all worked out well. Even though I feel the country is really in a bad place, in the end Im glad I live in a country where I am able to get the things I want. We get to own MG's at least for the time being so how cool it that! I hope my sons will be able own them during their lifetime if they so choose.     

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Just remember when you go to buy that machine-gun that like any other asset class it can quickly go from good to bad by paying to much. 2 cents

 

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Posted (edited)

6 hours ago, ShadowDoc said:

Let me ask the question this way, would you buy a machine gun if you knew for certain that five years from now it would be worth less than half what you paid for it? 

Hell yes. 

For what it's worth, I think the laws on machine guns will only get more restrictive, not less. They may even be completely banned at some point in the future. Even if I lost my machineguns and all the money I've spent on them tomorrow, I've had fun the past six years. It has been well worth the time and money for me. 

Edited by MontanaRenegade86

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Posted (edited)

OK GUYS, THE GLOVES ARE OFF AND THIS JUST GOT A  "X " RATING! no other words will fit in this story. Back in 1983 I bought 3  Maremont M-60's. in most cases, I bought more than one because when its broken or blown up, another may not be available and most of my life I shot more than 5k rounds a week  and used "battle field" pick up and ammo stored wrong to get the best price so the guns suffered a bit. anyhow back to the M-60's, when they came in, I loaded 6 20mm 1500rnd cans of lake city in my truck and went to the closest place I could shoot. that desert area drew shooters, ATV and motor cross riders in droves. I went to a box draw area unloaded and started emptying links. half way through the first can, I got up , looked around and there were maybe 15 or so bikes and a couple trucks behind me, just watching. I have always been out going and never missed a chance to promote the sport and a couple guys started asking about the gun. pretty soon it was maybe 10 guys talking around my tarp and someone asked how much the gun cost. I mentioned "these " are special and cost a bit more , but a typical belt fed gun package was "about 4 thousand" at that he looked at the 800 or so fired cases and asked ammo cost. I said it varies by quantity at the time but about 30 cents a round. he responded DAMN YOU MUST BE RICH! I said NO I JUST FOCUS ON THIS.  his response was "THAT COULD BE HARD WHAT DO YOU MEAN" ?  and I came back real fast, NO ITS EASY, JUST GIVE UP WOMEN , DRUGS AND ALCOHOL .  he looked at me real hard and said "FU*K THAT " !  my point in sharing that story is we all do things out side of the have to things and have a certain amount of flexable funds. in my case it has always been only gun related.  no outrageous dinner out. fast foods, alcohol etc. my early knowledge allowed me to do repairs for cash and that in turn gave me inside access to haunt the pawn shops and gun stores for those hidden treasures someone else wanted and a few sheckles came that way, but it ALL WENT TO MORE GUNS! I used to have long chats with the "lads" in Canada that had MG's and while they all were angry about the new laws that made their MG'S worthless, the fact that they could not get anything new or complete the collection upset them more. MYSELF? at 16 yrs old, I made a pact with society. I promised to obey CRIMINAL LAWS and be a positive contributing member. remember almost all traffic laws are civil violations, so I left that out. I do drive FAST. in turn I expected society to leave me be and allow me to pursue my interests. I have done so but "THEY" have not and "THEY" keep changing the rules! well change all you want, and GOD help anyone that attempts to force me to do things different than I have since then. you wont see me in line to "turn things in" they will have to come and get it.  I DO KNOW HOW TO FIX THIS WHOLE PROBLEM!  when a politician takes office in this country, they must swear to uphold the CONSTITUTION ! THE FIRST TIME THEY TALK ABOUT CHANGING IT OR THE 2ND AMENDMENT,   ARREST THEM AND IMPEACH THEM FOR VIOLATING THAT OATH!  I promise you it will only take ONE, then its ALL OVER and you can rest easy.

Edited by mike todd
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I only accept postal money orders. contact me DIRECTLY before sending any funds                                           email  myoldiron@outlook.com        

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I would have to say that MGs are not an investment for me not money wise anyway. They are instead an investment in fun. I think many guys buy them because they think they are a great investment but all you need is one politician to start the call to outlaw these "dangerous weapons" because "nobody needs a MG" and "it's for the chirrun". I really enjoy the ones that I own and a lot of times just like looking at them like a person admires a fine piece of art or a pretty woman. I am fairly certain after collecting for over 20 years that they will probably be outlawed one day but I enjoy them for the here and now because when you think about it that is all any of us have anyway. And to answer your question would I buy a MG knowing that in five years it would be worth half or less? Hell, yes!!! In fact, the ones that I currently own will probably be worth half or maybe even worthless. Would I do it all again? Yes, I would. To be honest, if I had a wife, I would probably tell her they are a great investment too. Just remember to do something nice for her too because you did kind of hoodwink her.

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10 hours ago, Schmeisser Guy said:

I would have to say that MGs are not an investment for me not money wise anyway. They are instead an investment in fun. I think many guys buy them because they think they are a great investment but all you need is one politician to start the call to outlaw these "dangerous weapons" because "nobody needs a MG" and "it's for the chirrun". I really enjoy the ones that I own and a lot of times just like looking at them like a person admires a fine piece of art or a pretty woman. I am fairly certain after collecting for over 20 years that they will probably be outlawed one day but I enjoy them for the here and now because when you think about it that is all any of us have anyway. And to answer your question would I buy a MG knowing that in five years it would be worth half or less? Hell, yes!!! In fact, the ones that I currently own will probably be worth half or maybe even worthless. Would I do it all again? Yes, I would. To be honest, if I had a wife, I would probably tell her they are a great investment too. Just remember to do something nice for her too because you did kind of hoodwink her.

Could not have said any of it any better!!!!

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I grew up liking guns. My father was not into them(perhaps because of WWII), but never said no to me owning them. I also liked to hunt, another thing my dad was not into. For as long as I can remember someone has had ads in the back of the magazines I read about machine guns.  I always wanted a machine gun & I always wanted to hunt in Africa. As a kid I was taught set goals & work towards achieving them. 

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On 5/21/2019 at 5:36 PM, mike todd said:

OK GUYS, THE GLOVES ARE OFF AND THIS JUST GOT A  "X " RATING! no other words will fit in this story. Back in 1983 I bought 3  Maremont M-60's. in most cases, I bought more than one because when its broken or blown up, another may not be available and most of my life I shot more than 5k rounds a week  and used "battle field" pick up and ammo stored wrong to get the best price so the guns suffered a bit. anyhow back to the M-60's, when they came in, I loaded 6 20mm 1500rnd cans of lake city in my truck and went to the closest place I could shoot. that desert area drew shooters, ATV and motor cross riders in droves. I went to a box draw area unloaded and started emptying links. half way through the first can, I got up , looked around and there were maybe 15 or so bikes and a couple trucks behind me, just watching. I have always been out going and never missed a chance to promote the sport and a couple guys started asking about the gun. pretty soon it was maybe 10 guys talking around my tarp and someone asked how much the gun cost. I mentioned "these " are special and cost a bit more , but a typical belt fed gun package was "about 4 thousand" at that he looked at the 800 or so fired cases and asked ammo cost. I said it varies by quantity at the time but about 30 cents a round. he responded DAMN YOU MUST BE RICH! I said NO I JUST FOCUS ON THIS.  his response was "THAT COULD BE HARD WHAT DO YOU MEAN" ?  and I came back real fast, NO ITS EASY, JUST GIVE UP WOMEN , DRUGS AND ALCOHOL .  he looked at me real hard and said "FU*K THAT " !  my point in sharing that story is we all do things out side of the have to things and have a certain amount of flexable funds. in my case it has always been only gun related.  no outrageous dinner out. fast foods, alcohol etc. my early knowledge allowed me to do repairs for cash and that in turn gave me inside access to haunt the pawn shops and gun stores for those hidden treasures someone else wanted and a few sheckles came that way, but it ALL WENT TO MORE GUNS! I used to have long chats with the "lads" in Canada that had MG's and while they all were angry about the new laws that made their MG'S worthless, the fact that they could not get anything new or complete the collection upset them more. MYSELF? at 16 yrs old, I made a pact with society. I promised to obey CRIMINAL LAWS and be a positive contributing member. remember almost all traffic laws are civil violations, so I left that out. I do drive FAST. in turn I expected society to leave me be and allow me to pursue my interests. I have done so but "THEY" have not and "THEY" keep changing the rules! well change all you want, and GOD help anyone that attempts to force me to do things different than I have since then. you wont see me in line to "turn things in" they will have to come and get it.  I DO KNOW HOW TO FIX THIS WHOLE PROBLEM!  when a politician takes office in this country, they must swear to uphold the CONSTITUTION ! THE FIRST TIME THEY TALK ABOUT CHANGING IT OR THE 2ND AMENDMENT,   ARREST THEM AND IMPEACH THEM FOR VIOLATING THAT OATH!  I promise you it will only take ONE, then its ALL OVER and you can rest easy.

I agree mike with you completely I’ve had many grown men not belive me when I said I’m waiting on my tax stamp on my first transferable then when it got here I had many older men ask me how I did it I said basicly what you said i don’t drink I don’t do drugs I dont party I work 60-80hr a week so I can afford guns. I also at a verry young age realized I was going to be a law abiding citizen belive it or not the only thing on my record is a 1 mile an hr over speeding tick and that’s from getting pulled over on the way to go pick up my mg lol... I told the cop I’m sorry man but I just got approved for my first machinegun I got to go he just looked at me confused as all hell said sit tight witch was cool I understand thats his job to pull people over but shit man? 1 mile over coooooome on hahahahaha it’s okay tho I broke the law and he cought me I’m a man about it. 

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13 hours ago, Thumpy said:

I also at a verry young age realized I was going to be a law abiding citizen belive it or not the only thing on my record is a 1 mile an hr over speeding tick and that’s from getting pulled over on the way to go pick up my mg lol... I told the cop I’m sorry man but I just got approved for my first machinegun I got to go he just looked at me confused as all hell said sit tight witch was cool I understand thats his job to pull people over but shit man? 1 mile over coooooome on hahahahaha it’s okay tho I broke the law and he cought me I’m a man about it. 

Dang criminal. :D 

Just kidding brother. 

I got a ticket for a seat-belt violation one time. Funny thing is, it was one of my passengers that wasn't buckled up. 

I may exceed the speed limit on occasion or fail to buckle my seat-belt, but according to the former clerk at the sheriff's office, I have a cleaner record than most of the deputies. 

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SORRY GUYS, but as I get older I have started to have a few regrets about how fast I drive. the fact that my speed endangered others out there just never hit me and I find the habit very hard to break to this day!  I always try to drive at night when taking a long trip and can still go 30 40 hours non stop no problem my last drive to the creek was non stop EXCEPT for 2 talks with troopers. neither one resulted in a citation but the ARKANSAS trooper did point out I could have been jailed for 40 over. actually about 85 is my comfort level. I keep my truck up completely and tires are replaced b-4 30k without fail. enough about that, the fact is I have been a positive part of society and MANY FAMILIES now live well because I was there. actually guns were a total loss for me financially because I gave EVERYTHING away already! and would gladly do it again many times over. the only other regret I have is destroying what guns I used up enjoying them back in the day and wasting good gun money on women. while involved I certainly took care of them and made sure they had all the goodies, but other than the first, they were all a complete WASTE!  in fact I gave up the first because I could not be what she needed , I could not play the social game with other families most of which were the type we spend all the time fighting politicly and just got tired of defending myself and my hobby to them. even with her I NEVER explained the cost or any details about the guns. I justified that by turning over my complete income from my job and using all the "outside income" for the hobby.   at the same time she never had to "explain" the designer purses, nail jobs or bi monthly hair work to me. I UNDERSTOOD THE NEED, even contributed at times and looked on it as the same as my hobby.


I only accept postal money orders. contact me DIRECTLY before sending any funds                                           email  myoldiron@outlook.com        

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I bought my Sten in '94 for $700 and taxes. It's worth more than that now. Really wish I'd eaten less pizza before turning 21, I would have some sears. Going through the wait for a .22 can now.

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funny  but even if we knew it could be 3 years or more to be approved there are still some of use that would fill out the forms ?


I only accept postal money orders. contact me DIRECTLY before sending any funds                                           email  myoldiron@outlook.com        

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1 hour ago, mike todd said:

funny  but even if we knew it could be 3 years or more to be approved there are still some of use that would fill out the forms ?

Yes sir I believe you are right.

 

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Yeah, a 3 year wait would be worth it. Had our annual shoot day among friends last month. The smiles people had after firing the NFA stuff are hard to not enjoy!

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Posted (edited)

On 5/28/2019 at 7:16 PM, riflejunky said:

Yes sir I believe you are right.

 

Until transfer times come down a little bit, I'd have to really, really, really want it.

If transfers took a few weeks to a couple of months, I'd be absolutely friggin' broke. 

Edited by MontanaRenegade86
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Great investment. Guns I bought 15 years ago I’ve traded for hot rods, down payments on rental properties, vacations and more machine guns. The value has gone up faster than any stocks I had. Everything has risks, yes you could loose it all at the swipe of a pen. What’s better than an investment you can play with. 

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Posted (edited)

   I bought my machine guns not caring if they were some how made to be non transferable and the registry done away with ... granted also I got them when the git’n was good .... Is it a good investment? Yes ... of course ... I would say most of us on the boards get into them because we have a passion for shooting , marksmanship , the beauty and effectiveness of a good machine gunner laying down effective suppressive fire .... 

   it’s tough to part with the amount of money it costs today to get into some of these guns, but history shows that since 1986 they have not gone down in value. 

    If your a shooter and buying machine guns you should strongly consider buying enough spare parts to keep it running for your great grand kids while you can ... most of these guns no longer in production. 

My first machine gun below ... German Mp5 (94 converted by S&H) with transferable S&H sear

Aaron - Mohnton, Pa

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Edited by Aaron in Mohnton Pa

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Some can be speculative investments in my book. For the majority I call it a "hobby that has a better than even chance of paying for itself in the end". And before one boo hoo's that - think about it. I'd say 95% of "hobbies" lose piles or money. It's a rare one that generally appreciates. Sure you can blow all the "profit" and then some on parts, shoots, ammo, etc- no doubt. But we are limited to talking about MG purchases themselves.

I backed out my 1st mg purchase- an hk mp5k w sear - in 1999/2000 to now. It has appreciated at about 9% a year. That's my real life example. That said I also have a few MGs that are flat.

I think it's unusual for one to sell a MG and actually lose money (not inflation adjusted. I mean absolute $ terms). Ask around--I cant ever remember a friend of mine losing money selling a MG.

Of course you have the political risk, the loooong stamp times , the insurance or risk of it being stolen/burned/destroyed like any collectible.

Here's a nice bonus and is not tax advice for you. I bet nobody pays tax on their MG sell gains...aside from dealers. That's huge if you are in high tax bracket. Compared to paying upwards of 40% combined state and local for some stocks/income.

 

In summary...it's a unique hobby for most , a lot of fun, and while expensive to enter, generally doesnt lose money but rather earns a bit.That's how I think of it in general. Oh and it's NOT liquid (at least on the buy side) at all--so expect your funds to be tied up for a long time.

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Posted (edited)

I've thought about this too, and one great truth keeps coming back to me -- for it to really count as an "investment", you have to be willing and able to sell it when its value reaches some certain level. If you would not sell it even when it's worth 10x what you paid for it, it's probably an expensive toy, not an investment.

P.S., you may decide for yourself what to tell the Mrs. :)

Edited by ManlyMatt

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On 6/7/2019 at 9:20 AM, rhouston8 said:

 

Here's a nice bonus and is not tax advice for you. I bet nobody pays tax on their MG sell gains...aside from dealers. That's huge if you are in high tax bracket. Compared to paying upwards of 40% combined state and local for some stocks/income.

 

As far as I’m concerned that 200 doller tax stamp I paid for is all the money the tax man should see from me for buying a firearm that should be protected by the constitution and I should not even have to ask permission or pay a tax to own in the first place....   that’s how I feel about it..

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THUMPY! SHAME ON YOU ! HOW RE THEY POSED TO FEED ALL DIM HALL MAGOTS AND INDIGENT SPERM RECEPTACLES  IFN YOU AND ME DON PAY TAXES?  THINK ABOUT HOW MUCH MONEY THEY NEED TO FUEL THE BUSES TO SHUTTLE ALL THE VOTERS AROUND THE GHETTO?   just between you and I what you declare has little to do with what they can hit you with. all they need do is watch and it WILL KETCH UP!  THE YEAR AFTER I LIQUIDATED MY BUSINESS , I BECAME  COMPLETLY AND OFFICALY DISABLED and am not required to file  ANY income tax statements for 22 years, because there isn't ANYTHING!  6 years after my last divorce I was "AUDITED" they needed to know how I could pay a $5700. per month mortgage with ZERO INCOME or cash assets ! one of the main reasons I left her is after I cut off access to the funds , she just got a credit line on our paid for home all without ANY SIGNATURE OR NOTICE TO ME!  I "gave" her the house in the settlement and she never took it out of my name so for almost 13 yrs IRS POUNDED MY BUTT and made it impossible to have a bank account longer than 90 days no matter how many times it was explained or what papers I sent, they still pulled the plug and I had to answer. when they quit making tin coffee cans, I went to 20 mm ammo cans, no long teller lines  or monthly fees , but it is impossible to cash a check.  I gave ALL my guns and ammo to a friend ,have a free hand buying or selling what "HE" needs live on the ranch and do what I WANT EVERYDAY! THE ONLY WORRY IS THOSE DAMNED YANKEE'S AND HOW YOU GUY'S ARE GOING TO HANDLE THEM  when this thing "IMPLODES ON ITSELF"


I only accept postal money orders. contact me DIRECTLY before sending any funds                                           email  myoldiron@outlook.com        

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13 hours ago, mike todd said:

THUMPY! SHAME ON YOU ! HOW RE THEY POSED TO FEED ALL DIM HALL MAGOTS AND INDIGENT SPERM RECEPTACLES  IFN YOU AND ME DON PAY TAXES?  THINK ABOUT HOW MUCH MONEY THEY NEED TO FUEL THE BUSES TO SHUTTLE ALL THE VOTERS AROUND THE GHETTO?   just between you and I what you declare has little to do with what they can hit you with. all they need do is watch and it WILL KETCH UP!  THE YEAR AFTER I LIQUIDATED MY BUSINESS , I BECAME  COMPLETLY AND OFFICALY DISABLED and am not required to file  ANY income tax statements for 22 years, because there isn't ANYTHING!  6 years after my last divorce I was "AUDITED" they needed to know how I could pay a $5700. per month mortgage with ZERO INCOME or cash assets ! one of the main reasons I left her is after I cut off access to the funds , she just got a credit line on our paid for home all without ANY SIGNATURE OR NOTICE TO ME!  I "gave" her the house in the settlement and she never took it out of my name so for almost 13 yrs IRS POUNDED MY BUTT and made it impossible to have a bank account longer than 90 days no matter how many times it was explained or what papers I sent, they still pulled the plug and I had to answer. when they quit making tin coffee cans, I went to 20 mm ammo cans, no long teller lines  or monthly fees , but it is impossible to cash a check.  I gave ALL my guns and ammo to a friend ,have a free hand buying or selling what "HE" needs live on the ranch and do what I WANT EVERYDAY! THE ONLY WORRY IS THOSE DAMNED YANKEE'S AND HOW YOU GUY'S ARE GOING TO HANDLE THEM  when this thing "IMPLODES ON ITSELF"

Lol mike as far as I’m concerned those lazy dems can starve to death and wollow in there own filth in the ghettos. Bunch of lazy good for nothing complaining cry babies honestly makes the rest of us look bad. At 15 my father walked out of my life leaving me to look after my mother and my handicapped sister I didn’t sit there for a hand out or think for one min some ones guna come pull the slack up and take care of us... what did I do? I went an busted my butt intill I could afforded a house bought it my mother and sister live there now. I made sure we never had to be on section 8 foodstamps or any of that bs gov programs unlike most people these days just a bunch of entitled punks expecting ever thing for free... I hate my generation bunch of pussys.

mike man if you don’t mind me asking what did you do for a living? Because from the sounds of it lol I’m in the wrong business... your house payment was 5700 a month!!! What ever you where doing must of been paying good my friend. 

As far as banks go I hate them as well they allways seem to ask me to many questions for my likening I feel like it’s nun of there dam business what I’m spending my money on personally.. 

an as far as the irs I dislike them equally as much I currently pay about 28% in tax’s on what I let those thief’s get there grubby little hands on....witch for me personally I think that is way to dam much for nothing I get in return.... not saying I don’t think I need to pay taxes... I’m just sayin they don’t need 28% of my money... 

as far as 20mm cans that’s a great idea lol they hold out water pretty good? 

And when this thing does implodes I hope for the best but just Incase I got ammo and Kevlar vests lol will most deff have a lot of land after it hahahaha

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Posted (edited)

"I’m just sayin they don’t need 28% of my money... "

 Demonic Demoncrat actual target  taxation is more  in the 50% to 67% of not Your  Money  but Our Money .

As for NFA as an investment?

  it would be strictly for  an investment in Freedom ... if you are willing  to risk all.

 

Edited by Born loser...in Montana
Sp

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Posted (edited)

On 6/17/2019 at 9:04 PM, Thumpy said:

Lol mike as far as I’m concerned those lazy dems can starve to death and wollow in there own filth in the ghettos. Bunch of lazy good for nothing complaining cry babies honestly makes the rest of us look bad. At 15 my father walked out of my life leaving me to look after my mother and my handicapped sister I didn’t sit there for a hand out or think for one min some ones guna come pull the slack up and take care of us... what did I do? I went an busted my butt intill I could afforded a house bought it my mother and sister live there now. I made sure we never had to be on section 8 foodstamps or any of that bs gov programs unlike most people these days just a bunch of entitled punks expecting ever thing for free... I hate my generation bunch of pussys.

 

You, sir, have two things...mettle and my utmost respect. 

If more people had your fortitude, this country wouldn't be in the sorry shape it is in now. 

In Liberty,

KH

Edited by MontanaRenegade86

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